in case anyone reading this is still clinging to mccain/palin

[rone]

Imagine if, in 2004, John Kerry had chosen Al Sharpton as his running mate.  That's what McCain/Palin is, only even more so.

Comments

[dr-strych9.livejournal.com]

...and if John Kerry really were the incompetent traitor the Swift Boat veterans painted him to be. Seriously... read the accounts of how McCain performed during the Forrestal fire. You can't even begin to imagine the contempt I came to have for him after I read about it.

p.s. I am a graduate of the U.S. Navy marine firefighting school on Treasure Island.

[ronebofh.livejournal.com]

That and Schanberg's account of his anti-POW activities as a member of the Senate. And, hey, Keating Five action.

[dr-strych9.livejournal.com]

Mind: I'm not one of those idiots who think McCain was responsible for starting the fire. No, I'm just massively underwhelmed with his performance during the crisis and in the aftermath. I do NOT approve. His behavior under pressure was utterly unbecoming of an officer, at best, and amounted to cowardice if you really want to know what I think about it. His behavior in the aftermath of the disaster was just icing on the shitpile.

What a despicable, horrible man.

[sunburn.livejournal.com]

Does anyone think he started it? He was in the plane that first started burning, but because it was hit by a Zuni rocket that cooked off from another airplane.

So I haven't read about the Forrestal fire-- what's a good source?

[dr-strych9.livejournal.com]

There are indeed idiots who are trying to spread the smear that McCain was directly responsible for the fire. (Some of them might be partially excused on account of their understandable prejudice against McCain given his record of crashing airplanes prior to his service on the Forrestal.)

You can read one of the Navy web pages on the Forrestal fire here (http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/ships/carriers/histories/cv59-forrestal/forrestal-fire.html). It doesn't say anything particularly damning about McCain's role in the fire. It just quotes him saying what he heard and what he saw from the cockpit of his aircraft.

There is also a documentary film (), which I have not seen, that may be of interest.

The article I read that made my blood boil when I read it is here (http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20081007_investigating_john_mccains_tragedy_at_sea/). Note that it takes an agnostic view about the possibility of McCain being somehow at fault in the cause of the fire. Here's what it says that made me want to puke:

Whatever the circumstances of the fire’s origins, McCain did not stay on deck to help fight the blaze as the men around him did. With the firefighting crew virtually wiped out, men untrained in fighting fires had to pick up the fire hoses, rescue the wounded or frantically throw bombs and even planes over the ship’s side to prevent further tragedy. McCain left them behind and went down to the hangar-bay level, where he briefly helped crew members heave some bombs overboard. After that, he went to the pilot’s ready room and watched the fire on a television monitor hooked to a camera trained on the deck.

Despite the widely repeated claim that he was hit by shrapnel in his legs and chest, his father says he came through the ordeal "without a scratch." There's a damned good reason that USN now makes sure that ALL HANDS are trained in fighting fires at sea. A lot of squids who weren't trained in fighting fires at sea died to save his sorry ass that day. I am deeply unimpressed with the way he treated their surviving mates during and after the fire.

[dr-strych9.livejournal.com]

Ooops. The documentary film is here (http://ussforrestalfire.com/).

[sunburn.livejournal.com]

Dad was a Squid Officer, and a Blackshoe Nuke, at that, so I'm inclined to chalk that up to McCain being an Airdale.

But you're right that if it's true, it's not good as a matter of character.

Not that I think every president needs a story of a time he was tested by fire, so to speak, but I'd like it if Obama had *any* history that he didn't himself write.

[dr-strych9.livejournal.com]

"but I'd like it if Obama had *any* history that he didn't himself write."

At this point, I'll settle for a President who hasn't made a lifetime career out of fucking off, taking stupid gambles for the cheap thrills, and failing upward at the expense of his less well-born comrades.

As for Obama's personal history, I was extremely skeptical of him a year ago. Over time, watching him weather the buffets of a Presidential campaign, which— make no mistake— is a psychological ordeal that ordinary people simply cannot endure without breaking down in a horrible mess, c.f. John McCain in recent weeks, I'm inclined to think the history Obama has already made in this campaign for all to see with their own eyes acquits him well enough to serve as President.

I just hope he performs as well in office as he has on the campaign trail. If he does, that will rewrite my whole attitude about the American political system from the ground up.

[bryant]

That's excellent.

[sunburn.livejournal.com]

Exactly-- why, look at that false rape allegation against a police officer that Palin used to leap into the spotlight! Why the hell do we pay her any attention whatsoever?

[vampyrecat.livejournal.com]

Palin is sort of hot, but she's so stupid it makes me mad. Can you imagine being governor of a state, let alone candidate for national office and not:
1. ...knowing any supreme court decisions you disagreed with other than Roe v. Wade;
2. ...knowing at least the basics of the current financial crisis;
3. ...knowing about the failure of so-called "trickle down" Regan-style economics;
4. ...getting up to speed on international politics?

[roseembolism.livejournal.com]

Well in all honesty, to appeal to her base, she only needs to know about one supreme court decision- Roe vs. Wade. It's not like the RCs care about any other court decision, so a soccer mom who's against abortion is exactly what they want.

I used to console myself with "well, at least she isn't as bad as Spiro Agnew", but having read of some of her actions, I had to conclude that if she got into office she'd be worse, far worse.

[sunburn.livejournal.com]

All four of those are ignorance, not stupidity. The world and the contiguous 48 states don't pay Alaska a hell of a lot of mind, especially when elections come around, so I don't know why we should be surprised that they don't keep us, and DC, on center stage all the time. As long as she's educable, she'll do fine.

[ronebofh.livejournal.com]

So far she's shown she's as educable as W. I really don't want another leader that displays a tenacious mental intransigence.

[vampyrecat.livejournal.com]

I think you missed my point. Those examples are to illustrate her inability to learn about issues that a vice presidential candidate should be able to discuss intelligently. I really do think she's too stupid to learn, or at least willfully ignorant.